Discipline In A Digital World: Men, Attention, And Boundaries

The year’s final roundtable pulls no punches: multitasking isn’t mastery, it’s leakage. We get real about how phones and platforms weaponize our attention, why splitting focus wrecks relationships, and how small, repeatable choices—like paper to-do lists, “time suck” folders, and device-free dinners—give our best energy back to family, work, and health. You’ll hear unfiltered stories: a child pushing her dad’s phone down during a movie, a solo parent owning how kitchen chaos turns texts cold, and a coach who locks social apps behind explicit guardrails so posting doesn’t spiral into scrolling.

We go deeper than tips. Attention is the new currency, and billion-dollar systems are engineered to capture it. So we build guardrails that match reality: notifications off by default, only calls allowed, posting in batches with a clear purpose, and analog planning to avoid app rabbit holes. We admit our personal traps—DM urgency, doom scrolling politics, reading one too many articles—and show how to add friction on purpose, including leaving the phone in another room and getting outside where presence is non-negotiable.

AI enters the chat with nuance, not panic. Generative tools are hammers; without craft they flatten thought. We talk prompt hygiene, verifying outputs, citing sources, and using AI like a sharp editor rather than a ghostwriter. Legacy demands digital discipline: without it, we leave memories, not impact. With it, we model family-first habits our kids can imitate—phones down at dinner, Sundays protected, and response-time norms that reclaim agency. If you’re ready to trade distraction for design and turn attention into action, hit play, share this with a friend who needs it, and leave a rating so more people can find the show.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Year-End Reflections And Mission
• 2:45 Multitasking Myths And Reality
• 8:40 Attention, Safety, And Relationships
• 13:20 App Overload And Toolboxes
• 18:14 Guardrails For Focus And Time
• 23:24 Boundaries At Home And In Public
• 30:48 Triggers: DMs, Doom Scrolls, And News
• 35:53 Digital Discipline And Legacy With AI
• 41:58 Accountability, Mentors, And Closing

Transcript

SPEAKER_04: 0:17

Welcome back to the men's roundtable series podcast. I'm your host, Mr. U. We got our guys in the house, Warriors. Morning Warriors. Come up with it early. Morning, brother. Good morning, guys. How you doing? Everybody is everybody.

SPEAKER_03: 0:31

Everybody good? Yeah. That's right.

SPEAKER_04: 0:33

But this is our last show of 2025. Kind of kind of kind of it's kind of kind of hit me in the fields, man. I'm like, oh wow. Okay, went through a whole year. Wow, this is this is crazy. All right. So I'm excited about it because it's our last one. Guys are going to holiday breaks and stuff, and then we come back sometime in January 2026, smoking hot again, ripping it up, making making moves, changing lives. All of the testimonies that you guys, well, some of you guys haven't heard about it, but trust me when I tell you this. If you're watching the show for the first time or you're listening for the first time, this is not just another podcast. That would be easy for us if it was that, but it's not that. And people across the country, I'm hearing, I'm hearing testimonies from everywhere, not global so much yet, but across the country. People's lives are changing because of what they hear on this show. Men in this safe space talking about issues that are germanian to men, and they're making changes. Life changes, life is happening for them, and it's happening in uh in the best possible way. It's because of you guys, guys, the guys on this panel, sharing their testimony and lives and being transparent about what they got, what they get good, what they get right, and what they don't get right, and people are being changed by it. So I'm excited about keeping this going and for you guys to be a part of this incredible movement. So thank you. Just when you say that up front, man. Thank you guys for doing this and being here, man.

SPEAKER_03: 1:56

I appreciate you having me on with distinguished gentlemen. Um, the diversity of voices always is important. Uh, yeah, man. Thank you for for providing us with this platform.

SPEAKER_01: 2:10

My pleasure, absolutely, man. My pleasure. Absolutely, 100%. Thanks for inviting us, brother.

SPEAKER_04: 2:15

My pleasure. All right, so the guy's having a few issues. Come on, Aaron, figure it out, brother, so we can get you in here, man. All right, so we're gonna talk about now. If you have if you've been watching, we started this in June, so it hasn't been a full year yet, but it's been uh more than six months. Uh, and it's been hot fire since we started. But we talk about issues that we believe are that that matter to men, things that we have issues with that men naturally and globally deal with. Um honest about it, we don't always get everything covered, and we have you know time restraints and stuff, but we always want to get into some stuff that's deep for us, and today we're gonna talk about discipline in a digital world. Now, I know it's not a man issue, but because we're talking to men, that's the perspective we're coming from today. So let's kind of kick it off with a just an idea because I have a question about this. I want to hear you guys' thoughts on this regarding multitasking. First off, are you a multitasker and is that working for you? Because my mindset on that has changed over the past 12 months or so. It's been a little bit different. But are you guys multitaskers? Is that working for you? Talk about that a little bit.

SPEAKER_01: 3:31

I'll jump in on that one, man. Um, I I like to think I am, but in truth, I'm not. Not and I end up catching myself all the time. Um, I'll be in the middle of working on something and then something else pops up, and I go, Oh, let me take care of this real quick. And I literally have to stop myself and go, wait, stop. No, go back to the finish this, right? So it's an ongoing battle, man. I mean, people think that multitasking is like a uh something to take pride in. You know, I'm doing all these things at the same time. We can't do that anymore, you know. Back in the day, like when I was young, you know, and dinosaurs were on the earth, you know, everything was really cool, and you could multitask because you only had a few tasks to deal with. Now, with everything popping up like every 15 seconds, you you can't multitask, man. You will get buried and just was it even good back then? Well, I thought it was about it.

SPEAKER_04: 4:22

Now I realize it good back then. We thought it was, but was it really?

SPEAKER_01: 4:26

We thought it was, man. But yeah, now we know. Now we know better.

SPEAKER_04: 4:31

Anybody else? Are you a multitasker? And is that actually working for you?

SPEAKER_03: 4:34

I I concur with what what Rory said. Uh, I thought I was uh uh good at it, and then you know, reflecting back, man, I was doing too much. And I guess you know, as time and experience and age hits us, we realize that our capacity to pay attention to more than one thing at the same time is just not there. So I don't do, I try not to do it, and I I have to remind myself to slow down, like stop, stop, finish this task, move on to the next task. And uh for some people it may work for me. I tried it, I thought it worked. I wouldn't, I wouldn't encourage it.

SPEAKER_04: 5:19

I don't know how it works, but the math is just not mathing. People talk about I grew up hearing this, and I it should be a long time to challenge it that we want to give a hundred percent to everything. I'm like math-wise, I'm like, okay, so we're giving a thousand percent. We only have a hundred. So, how is that working? So I felt like you know, all this back and forth and this switching and this multitasking, we're not we're not really effective, we're kind of giving minimal effectiveness in these different places, and it's not the full uh uh scope, I guess you can say. Think about this for example before you guys jump in. As a kid, I don't know if you guys were like me, but in this inner city kids were really bored. We had limited things to do, so I found ways to entertain myself. So I found out that a magnifying glass you can magnify the light from the sun and you can burn things with it. Now, when you're out in wherever you live, if it's 80, 90, 100 degrees, for you it's like, oh, it's scorching hot, I'm I'm melting it, and you get real dramatic about it. But if I put a magnifying glass on that same heat you're talking about and put it on something, it it's it's 10 times, 100 times uh more intense. And I feel like if you're multitasking, you minimize that level of effectiveness when you're focusing on that task and you're and I think it's a I don't think it's just a men thing, but because we're talking to men, perhaps we can all share some insights on that. But for us, if we focus on the things that you know matter and be focused on those things solely, I think we come out so much better, it gets done. It's not an unfinished project sitting in our garage or in our office somewhere, our wives are tripping over it because we haven't finished you know what we started. But somebody else go ahead and jump in. Are you a multitasker? Is it working?

SPEAKER_02: 7:11

I think we got to sort out the difference between multitasking and having multiple things happening at the same time, right? Okay, okay. So years ago when I was working corporate IT, they did a study, and you could have up to three screens and increase efficiency. And that was when you know screens were like standard 17 or 19-inch screens, right? So you could have up to three screens and increase efficiency at four, efficiency plummeted hard, right? And it was a matter of turning head and how many windows you could have open because it was breaking your attention. I have two widescreen monitors, and it's it's a wide throw on my I have to turn my head a lot at this point. I can have lots of things open to support what I'm doing, right? There's a difference between having lots of information, lots of pieces to the puzzle to work with, and being multitasking, right? So push that to the side because there are those of us who have like six programs open simultaneously while we're working or something, right? Have music in the background, programs, right? We all have lots of tabs open and crap like that. That is not multitasking, that is having all your resources available in one space so you can go through the task you're focused on. Fair. If you get into multitasking, you immediately, immediately have a drop in performance, period. Your brain just can't do it. Yeah, right. When we're talking about de-escalating situations uh for like relationships, we use a pattern interrupt, right? We two we tap into two senses simultaneously. So if you're in the middle of an argument with somebody, if you point one direction and snap with the other hand the opposite direction, it will actually break the flow. Why? Because your brain physiologically cannot handle two different neuro inputs on two different senses at the same time. Yeah, so that's exactly what we do when we start multitasking. We're trying to feed multiple inputs, and our brain is going, wait, wait, glitch, glitch, glitch. Syntax.

SPEAKER_04: 9:26

Oh, right, Aaron. Englossman?

SPEAKER_00: 9:28

Yeah, I actually experience this a lot. I'm a horrible multitasker, but I'm also a solo parent. So it's almost required for me on the days that I have my kids to be a multitasker because there is so much going on. And I have I've actually had a lot of conversations with my my current partner about this because I will have moments of just very like brash communication because I am multitasking, I'm making dinner, my kids homework, I'm doing all of these things. And I'm also trying to send a text message to, you know, this person who adores me and loves me. And I am saying the most minimal words possible in the most straightforward way because I'm doing 10 different things. And it actually was affecting my relationship because she's like, why are you talking to me this way? And there, we we had to have a conversation about how it's actually my my issue is like because I'm trying to multitask when really what should happen is I should be focusing on what's in front of me, my kids dinner, whatever, whatever it may be, and not trying to add this extra, you know, communication in there and it going horribly. So, you know, like this this conversation, it hits home because it it happens to me quite often. And and I I think, you know, it kind of leads to to a sense of discipline in what you can actually take on, you know, and and having that understanding that I maybe maybe I shouldn't be trying to send this text message right now and that I should just make sure that I'm not burning this food, or that my you know, my kids are asking me for help with their math, and that I can just focus on that, you know, because it starts to affect other parts of your life.

SPEAKER_04: 11:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 11:28

Yeah, I think that's what everybody's saying, it sounds like, right? Anyone else? Additional questions? Adding on to what Aaron just said about uh uh dialing in on where you are, there's a reason why we're told not to text and drive. We know the dangers of that, right? That's as simple as uh an ask uh that we can do for each other as a society. So if we think about multitasking in that same way, driving and texting, don't do it. Minimum tasks in your house in regards to having a conversation with your spouse, not the time to be doing other stuff. Put the phone down, give them your undivided attention so that they know you're locked in. I know I'm locked in, and I'm not gonna misinterpret what was being said because I was distracted trying to do two or three other things.

SPEAKER_04: 13:08

Yes, definitely, good stuff, man. This whole digital thing, this is so deep. I wonder if we get possibly get through the whole thing before it's time for us to shut it down because it is a lot to this, the distraction level with the devices and content, it's is it's gonna just go on and on, and it's not helping that we got AI now, man. We got little tools to help us, I guess, do things more efficiently, I guess you can say, and it's like I had to do a little experiment, and I want to ask you about it because it's funny, but I I could be condemning myself right here publicly in front of everybody by doing this, but it is what it is. But I had to ask myself, how many apps do I have on my phone? And do I use them all? Because I know in the past I would say I got all these apps that you know they force you to download when you uh when you boot up and whatever, but I don't I got like about 75-ish apps on my phone. Now my follow-up question is, do I use all of these apps? And I'm like, I use almost all of them. It'd be easy for me to say I don't use them all. Easy, get rid. But I I use almost all of these constantly, no, but I use them all whether it's a banking app here, I use once in a while, maybe once a month or something, or this other app for notation, or and it's like 75 apps. How about you guys? We you we you guys are I think I'm a uh a unicorn right now. Am I the only one on this call that has a lot of apps and I use all almost all of them? Come on, save me, guys. Help me. I'm thinking I'm drowning right now.

SPEAKER_02: 14:49

Brother, I'd love to save you, but I have a handful of apps I actually use on a daily basis. All the other apps on my phone exist, like uh, you know, I've got some of the smart stuff in my house, right? So I've I've got you know the app to connect it to the plug-in for this brand to connect to my Amazon device because you have to have that brand's plug-in, smart plug-in app to connect it to your but I have apps like that that I use once in a blue moon, uh and then I have like three or four apps I use all the time, and that's it. But I actively like intentionally stay away from my phone. I hate my phone, I don't want it. If I could get away with not having a smartphone, I would absolutely just ditch the smartphone. I've I've seriously considered just going back to a flip phone.

SPEAKER_01: 15:35

I'll save you, man. I I have no problem saving you, you um, and let me just say, uh, I'm not very happy that you made me just count my apps on my phone. Ignorance was bliss for me. Okay, I was happy in my ignorance until you made me just count them. I have 107 apps on my phone.

unknown: 15:54

Holy smokes!

SPEAKER_01: 15:55

And just with a quick glance in the last couple of minutes here, I I use all of them, um for various, you know, god, whatever. And and now I'm I don't know, I'm starting to feel bad about it, man.

SPEAKER_04: 16:07

And I use them I thought important to emphasize. I know I'm just I'm just wondering, I'm just wondering where we are in this, and because this is part of you know what keeps what keeps men occupied in some. Well, I think part of it, brother, is that too, you know.

SPEAKER_01: 16:23

If if you have an online business, you know what I mean, and that's the other thing. I mean, I I have online businesses, you know, I've got seven podcasts, I do social media management, all this other stuff. I mean, I've got like four pages of apps of just little things I need to use here and there and back and forth, and just editing apps and this. And if I need that art, I go here and that art, I go there. And yeah, you got one app for some music, one app for a picture, one app for a video. I mean, there's all kinds of things you got. Yeah, it goes on, you know what I mean. So it's you got to have all kinds of different accounts to pay for all kinds of different things in all kinds of different ways. It's like just there's lots of stuff you need on your phone if you're working online. So, you know, yeah, I look at it and I feel okay about it though. I gotta be honest with you. Number of apps, I don't think is the issue. I feel like I want to throw it out.

SPEAKER_04: 17:06

The financial level that you are on, it I'm sure you do feel great. I don't feel good in comparison. Like, well, I can't afford to do all of these. Like, wow, where am I at? What am I doing wrong? I feel like they're in reverse. I don't feel great about them at all. Happy for you, but don't get me wrong.

SPEAKER_02: 17:24

I have a ton of apps on my phone, I just don't use most of them, except that I I am the same reason Rory is. Oh, I gotta jump on and look at this count. Oh, I gotta jump on and fix this, right? I only use like four or five regularly. But I that's the part, Brent.

SPEAKER_04: 17:39

That's the part. You only use four regularly.

SPEAKER_02: 17:42

I can't even try to put a zero on the end of that, yeah. But you know regularly. I mean every how hard is it to actually like get me to respond to you?

SPEAKER_04: 17:51

I mean, you're my friend, and I'm not I'm I'm I'm not even gonna do that to you.

SPEAKER_02: 17:56

So I I just don't like phones, dude. I you know what it was, I had that wake-up call and I realized how much time I was spending on my phone, and so my brain has just flipped a switch where I try not to touch it at this point because I realized how much time I was spending on it. That's fair.

SPEAKER_04: 18:14

Steve, uh I don't know what people want to answer at this point. Where are you guys at with this? This is this is a thing, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00: 18:20

You know, for me it's it's really interesting. And I I think I came into this talking about being a parent, but you know, my my kids are the our biggest mirrors. And they actually are really good about calling me out when I'm on my phone. And you know, so that has been a big sort of of it's been a big like a big reckoning, so to speak, like because attention is that's the biggest value, right? Like we live in a day and age where where you know currency is not is not actually money, it's it's attention. It's what apps you're using, what shows you're watching, and it also applies in your household. Are you paying attention to your phone? Are you paying attention to the person that's right in front of you at the dinner table? And my kids are really quick at being like, Dad, get off your phone. You know, so for me, it's like, yeah, I I run an online business. I, you know, I have to use all of these things. I'm, you know, I'm I'm on social media, I'm promoting, you know, all of these advertising, all that kind of stuff. But I I have to be conscious about how much I use that and when I use it and when I'm in, well, you know, especially when I'm around my kids. My brother my my son will be like, put your phone down, you know, he's 10 years old, he has no filter whatsoever. And he he calls me out. And, you know, and I and I I think that that's that's kind of a really good commentary to where we are in this world, like the younger generation and how much time we spend on these digital devices. Um, you know, because they don't they don't have a filter, they're not gonna just let you, you know, do it. At the same time, how many how often, I'd love to ask all of you guys, like, how often are you in a conversation with somebody, say at a coffee shop or something, and somebody is in the conversation shaking their head, listening to you, but also on their phone doing something else. You know, like to me, that like that just like like burns me up inside. I'm like, man, pay attention, just pay attention. Like you, you, you can't. I'm fair, man.

SPEAKER_05: 20:31

I don't like when that happens, man.

SPEAKER_00: 20:33

Exactly. You know, but it's it's you know, and I and I and it may just be me being in my 40s and you know, and and and being the the grizzled, you know, turning into that grizzled old man because I feel like the young Youthful generation is like they're completely more attuned to to multitasking and BML to actually have this conversation and be doing things on their phone and have complete attention and understand and retain everything that you're, you know, I I could be wrong. Maybe they're good at faking it, but you know, but it's that's like it's really common for that to happen. And it it just like it really gets me, man.

SPEAKER_03: 21:13

Yeah. Okay. So so I I don't know if the issue is the number of apps that we have. Uh I like to use a not a lot of practical analogies, right? We all have tools, right? In our tool in our shed or our you know, garage. Do you ever ask yourself how many tools do you have? Most of the time we don't. Not enough. We have and we have tools for specific things because when you need a tool and you don't have it, you gotta go get it. I think of apps the same way, right? They are all tools in my toolbox. When I need to pull them out, I can pull them out. Some I use more frequently than others, others, they're just there. And I may need them or I may not. It doesn't uh it doesn't mean it's a bad thing. It just depends on how much time you choose to give to the one or two. So if you're using four and you're using four too much, that's as as bad as having 200 apps, you know. So that that's where I would come down on it.

SPEAKER_04: 22:23

Thank you. Like, thank you, Stevie.

SPEAKER_03: 22:32

Well, to tag in back to what Aaron said is as well in regards to our attention span. I think when we were younger, we did think we'd have the ability to multitask and do multiple things because our our brain is young, it's fresh, and our hard drive was able to process more at a at a faster rate. As you get up in age, that processor doesn't work as good as the newest Intel processing chip, right? We still may have a Windows 2000 processor. Oh boy, and it's only gonna get worse, you know, the older we get. So we have to actually, in order to be effective in our communication, we almost have to tell ourselves stop, give this person or this thing my attention, because that's all the hard drive space that I have for this thing.

SPEAKER_04: 23:28

It's all about capacity, man. Let's keep moving to the uh the discipline aspect of the discussion because I think that's one thing that you know I know men that have any kind of exposure to the military, they know the word discipline and they get what it looks like and they live as regimented a lifestyle as you can based on their circumstances. But how do you guys guard your attention as a man when it comes to content devices? What kind of safeguards do you put in? You know, Aaron has his kids to kind of uh be security guards and everything, but no, but but besides that, what do you guys do as safeguards to kind of protect against you know the uh fall into a lack of discipline when it comes to content and devices and your time spent in the digital world?

SPEAKER_02: 24:18

I'll jump right in on that one. It's all about my actual purpose and goals. I I have just and and it's come with age and experience. I have this is my priority box, and these are my goals. And if it's not feeding those, that is my guardrails. Anything that's not feeding the things that are actually truly important, the goals, the purposes, the principles I live by, right? My family's high up on that, time with my family, being a good dad is time on that, right? If it doesn't feel those goals, everything in my life is either taking from me or it's giving to me. And if it's not giving towards what I'm going towards, that's the guardrails. I love it. My my social media app folder is labeled time suck. Like I have a folder, it says time suck, and all my social media apps are in it. So I have one more that that's just the only guardrail I have on my phone. Is that one more reminder that I'm clicking on something that just spells out this is a time suck, like this is gonna waste your time.

SPEAKER_01: 28:12

Yeah, I love that. I absolutely love that. Brent, you know, I'm one of these guys, man. I'm I'm this guy, right? This is my to-do list still on paper. I have about 19 of these in a box, you know what I mean? And I and I'll go get more when I need them. But I even clock what I got to do on social media on that. Yep, exit. There you go. I see, you know, because if I have to be on my phone in an app taking the notes on what I'm doing to try and avoid being in another app, then I'm already in the rabbit hole. So by keeping it on paper, it keeps me separate from that. So if I have to go into Facebook to do posts for myself, or I have to go into Instagram to do posts for one of my clients or something, I'm going in there on purpose, and there's a box, you know, that says, Go do the Instagram load for you know, Youssef on this day and this time. And I'm completing the task. So when I'm done, I'm checking that box and I'm getting out of that app, you know. Uh and so that that's the discipline I think of like going in, getting out in terms of our time. Uh, you know, you I love the question because you could go anywhere you want with that in terms of the discipline portion of it, because we have to have discipline about what we're looking at while we're in there, we have to have discipline about you know uh how long, and we have to have discipline about you know what's going on outside of us when we're in there doing whatever it is we're doing. So there's there's a ton of ways you could take that question, but uh, I just wanted to you know applaud Brentz because that's key. If if you don't keep on track of your priority, like why the heck are you on social media in the first place or in that app in the first place? They're all designed to keep you stuck. You bet they're all designed to suck you in and keep you there, so it's it's a battle, man.

SPEAKER_04: 29:51

The Instagram scroll thing is a real thing, man. See a funny video, and guess what they do? They put you in the in the in the loop, and they got videos just like it, and it's like oh, hours pass. Not cool.

SPEAKER_03: 30:03

All right, who else? Yeah, I think everybody has to have their own measure of discipline in regards to what doing what you need to do to uh maximize your time and not waste a lot of time. Uh, sure there's time for leisure and scrolling and that kind of stuff, but it's it has to be like an internal clock that says you've been on this app too long, you've been listening to these podcasts too long. And we all know people who set time limit restrictions on their devices, and then when the time limit comes up and says, You've been on this thing too long, you hit snooze or you just turn it off and keep scrolling. I don't, I don't, I don't count that as discipline. Uh and and I don't know what the right answer is. Everybody has to individually figure out how much time you're gonna spend on these things. And Rory was absolutely right, what you're looking at, and having the discipline not to click this video or click this link for moral reasons, for safety reasons, for financial protection, because we are all bombarded all the time with somebody encouraging us to do something by clicking on a link, and then that link leads to another link where somebody uh may be trying to scam you out of your money, and that is a deterrent for me. I just I can't give it, I can't give it all that. I have too many other things going on to give social media technology all of my time and attention. I I shut down, I disconnect for two or three days, and I'm I'm good with that.

SPEAKER_04: 31:45

I love it. Sorry for the background noise. The office is next to a flight school, so yay! All right, anybody else?

SPEAKER_00: 31:53

Yeah, I mean, I just kind of wanted to add what Steve said is I was that guy. I had all those apps that you know that would cut off my time. I I I think the the funniest one for me was you know, I I bought that app that made me do push-ups in order to to open up the the certain certain apps that you that you wanted and you had a a time limit, and then you had to do more push-ups in order to put it up. And and they never work. Like it doesn't work. You like like you said, Steve, you you push right past that and then you put the hit the snooze and you keep going. But for me, I think the discipline comes in just getting off the phone. I I I lock it in a box, or I force myself to go outside and just not be around, not have it in my pocket, not be subjected to the the feeling of a notification buzzing in your pocket, or just getting it away from me. And um, you know, I was I was talking to to my partner actually yesterday. I I'm a surfer and and I'm teaching my my girlfriend how to surf. And she was having a really rough day yesterday, and we went out into the water, and she, you know, got rocked by a wave, and she's just learning, so it was pretty traumatic. And one of one of the things that she was she was saying, she's like, I'm you know, I'm done, like this is just horrible. I'm feeling rocked right now. And I said, just give it some time, because being in nature is going to shift your your you know your perspective, right? And uh, and about a half hour, 45 minutes later, we we were talking about other things and caught a couple waves, and and she goes, Man, I feel so much better. And I said, Yeah, I said, This is one of the only places where you have to be present because you're in the ocean. You can't take your phone into the water. So you have to sit there and you have to be in the middle of the ocean, not in the middle of the ocean, but you know, on the edge, on the edge of the the coast, and you have to sit and wait for a wave to come for you to then physically try to catch it and write it. And just in being present and sitting forces you to not want to disassociate and scroll and do all the and do these things. So for me, that discipline comes in time and nature. And just not taking my phone with me and not allowing, like forcing myself to actually be distant from that device that can control, you know, that is that is wired to and made to control our currency of attention.

SPEAKER_02: 34:36

Aaron just blew the lid off the secret to all this guy's right here. If you're busy living, your phone rarely distracts you. If you're actually busy living a life that is worth living, you're not as prone to actually surf or surf the internet or get lost in your phone because you're busy living. I love it, I love it.

SPEAKER_04: 35:00

Right, this conversation gets pretty deep. All right, so it leads us to a conversation about boundaries because I there's no way to not touch this based on where we're already heading right now. Have you guys already started to create boundaries for yourself as a man? I don't mean just what we're talking about so far, but just because of what the things that we deal with that we talked about many times on this on this broadcast. Have you guys started to create boundaries? What's that look like? What kind of boundaries have you created? Let's talk about that for a little bit.

SPEAKER_03: 35:34

Uh I don't want the perception of anything nefarious going on. That's my boundary. I'm not DMing nobody, I ain't clicking on a picture and doing too many likes because the last thing I want is my wife to see something and read more into it than what it is, and then now it's creating a problem in our relationship that is totally avoidable just by me having the discipline enough not to respond to certain things or respond to them in a certain way because they could be misinterpreted, and I don't want to send out the wrong kind of signal. So uh it ain't easy, but you you gotta know what you're dealing with, who you're dealing with, and how the person you're in relationship with is gonna respond to your online activity and the things you're clicking on and watching, etc.

SPEAKER_02: 36:28

I love it, I love it. Gross. You said boundaries. This whole conversation started with like you know, devices and stuff like that. I had a wake-up call when I was sitting with my daughters a couple years ago. I have I have one afternoon a week that's just theirs, nothing else happens. I block it out, it's their time, right? I was sitting watching a movie with my daughter that I have seen probably a hundred times. Her and I watched it, you know. If you have kids, you you know you've you've got those movies. I love and hate Disney at moments, right? Because we all have we all went through those movies, right? Watched Frozen a thousand times. Oh boy, right? I was sitting watching hole or I was sitting watching a movie with my daughter, and it was a movie we'd seen tons of times, and she reached over and put her hand on my hand on my phone and pushed my hand down. I said, What's up, baby? She said, You you said you were hanging out with me. I said, I'm right here, baby. You're cuddled up with me, right? We've seen this before. She said, You're supposed to be here with me. I said, Do I need to put my phone down? And that was the whole start of this digital discipline for me. And that was about two and a half, three years ago now. Um, and that bleeds into the boundaries for me start setting in because it's taking time to learn that my attention is the most valuable asset I have. Right. I have two daughters, my wife and my mom lives with us, she's 74. I have four people who want my attention all the time. And I make my living on social media, on YouTube, on podcasting, right? That's where my so the world is fighting for my attention. I'm fighting to keep their attention, but I have four ladies in my life who want my attention constantly, right? And we won't even talk about my dog, who is just an attention whore. But wow, we all have that. Well, you know, we all have the dog, right? The the dog is my best friend, she loves me more than I love her, I'm pretty sure. But everything is fighting for my attention all the time, and so it took a couple years. I'm a little I'm a slow learner to realize that my attention is my absolute most valuable asset. And so I started setting in on just hard boundaries. You know, I were talking on the side. No, I don't get email notifications on my phone, I get text messages, I only get text messages from certain people, I get phone calls, and I get my alarm clock. And that's the only notifications on my phone, despite having way too many apps because I'm I'm like Rory. I've been sitting here counting now since you asked.

unknown: 39:11

That's great, that's great.

SPEAKER_02: 39:12

I only use four or five, but I I got way more than that. Why are you doing it? Right. I just don't I don't have notifications coming. I have notifications from my computer, not on my phone, because my phone goes with me places, and I don't be at your computer longer because everything's going over there.

SPEAKER_04: 39:28

It's like we're not avoiding this script.

SPEAKER_02: 39:31

Once I no, once I walk away from my computer, I just I'm done. I I walk away from it. That's why that's why I get a response back.

SPEAKER_05: 39:37

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_02: 39:38

It's it's hard boundaries, though. And it all because is because I have two little girls and a wife who wants my attention constantly, and our schedules are insane, and so I protect those boundaries really, really hard from the outside because I realized that day with my daughter that things were taking my attention that had no value in my life, were stealing my attention from my kids, and so I it started just started this whole crusade, and I've been setting boundaries in place. When I walk away from my computer, I don't get notifications from my computer. When I'm on my phone, I don't get notifications. If you call me, I'm gonna hear that. That's about it, right? And it's because I choose where my attention goes now. Um, I've I've certainly been guilty. Like, I've jumped on Instagram. Instagram's my weak spot. I I can I can do scroll really easy. If I I'll jump on there to do a post and then I'll see something and start that Doom Scroll, and it's like, nope, nope, right? And I will go move my phone to another room. Um everything wants it. You have to figure out the boundary, and the most important boundaries you set are those that protect your attention. Everything else is gonna fade out. I love it. I love it. Thank you, Shah.

SPEAKER_01: 40:54

Aaron, go for it, man. I'll go later.

SPEAKER_04: 40:57

Oh no, you go, Roy. You guys are gonna fight over who's gonna go. I mean, that we're doing, really? You got the bullshit.

SPEAKER_01: 41:06

All right, you're killing me, Aaron. I was trying to be polite. All right. All right. Um, I'm actually really proud of myself on this one, and I don't get that that often, but um, because my wife and I have been working on this for a long time. When uh, you know, we had uh three kids and they all did sports, and so we've for a very long time had you know kind of one of those rules like uh where we limited stuff, you know, at the sporting event was really important to make it there. And we found out pretty quick. Well, if you're there and you're on your phone, then you're not really there. And so phones only for pictures, you take the picture, you put it away. And uh, you know, if we're at a football game, the whole family's there with us, so no one's gonna call me about anything that's an emergency. My whole family's at the game, so foot phones are off, like all the way off, not even on silent, just off. Oh, wow. Um, so that we can be present in in their events. It was easy to start that way because they were set events, and my kids were all you know, big athletes, so it was like, all right, football, track, whatever, no phone. Um, then we were able to take that over into hey, we go to dinner, phones in the middle, you know, stuff like that. My boys jumped on that and they started doing that in their own lives. And so, you know, we go to dinner with uh with them uh a few weeks ago, and my youngest son, without anybody saying anything, he and his wife just put the phone in the middle of the table and they lead the way with it. And I'm like, oh, look at that. So me and the wife are pulling our phones out, putting it in the middle of the table. It's like, all right, cool. Once you establish it and you realize the importance of it, like you know, Brent said, you know, once you get the idea that it's important, then it's just repetition, you know, and then it's it's just set that boundary and move on. Um, especially when you have an online business, you you absolutely could get contacted every five seconds about something that needs attention. And if you don't stop, I mean, you're gonna work 24 hours a day, seven days a week, you know. So you gotta you gotta just stop. Yeah, you know, and now my wife and I are working on this stuff with just us. So, you know, Sunday's my day where I don't schedule anything, you know, phone is minimal, and then we have those times when we're like having dinner or doing something together, and it's like phone's off. Forget it, you're not gonna reach me on a Sunday, nine times out of ten. So just how it goes. But it takes a little while to get there, but once you have that that big moment like Brent had, you know, where I mean you're brought to tears by your kid, it's like I, you know, there's no discussion after that. It's like boom, done. Boundary.

SPEAKER_04: 43:18

Yeah, it's hard to there's no comeback for this. All right, Aaron. Great, man. Good stuff, Lori. Thank you, sir.

SPEAKER_00: 43:24

I think what I'm what I'm hearing from both of you guys, Brent. And Rory is this idea that, you know, it's something that's important with boundaries, is you can set a boundary, but it's also really important to hold the boundary. And I actually believe that's the most important aspect of boundaries. Because you can say, oh, I'm not going to do this, or I don't, I don't like this behavior. And then somebody will just bulldoze that, that, and then you allow it. And now that boundary is completely gone, right? So for me, it's it's like holding that boundary, setting that standard. Like Rory said, like you taught your kids to hold that boundary to where they're now holding it for you by just quietly setting the phone, your son quietly setting the phone on the table and in, you know, and in doing that, instructing everyone else to do it. Like that's that's phenomenal. But I think it's all it's just important to actually hold the boundary. Like, and we unfortunately, when we when we're talking about, you know, digital age and and the use of of immediacy in in apps and text messaging and things like that, it's actually kind of hard to hold the boundary because people have an expectation that you have your phone in your pocket, why can't you just respond back to me right now? I know you saw it, you know, and and I think that like people need to be reminded that we actually have the ability to not respond right away. Like that's our choice as as people. And you know, I can see it, but I don't actually have to respond. I can take some time, I can take what time I need to come up with a very logical response or or put some thought into how I'm going to respond to this. Or I may actually be with my kids and not want to deal with that right now. Like that's my choice, and that's my boundary to hold. You know, and it's it's something that now with phones and pocket computer, you know, I like to call them pocket computers, it that that we lose that that idea that that we we lose agency in choosing when we respond.

unknown: 45:41

I love it.

SPEAKER_03: 45:42

Great point. I'll if I could add on real quick, depending on where you what stage you are in your life and what your career is, sometimes it's really hard to disconnect because there's a constant need to uh be accounted or be reached. Prime example in the military, I could I never disconnected. I was always on duty 24 hours a day. I needed to be reached in case. Once I shifted, or once I retired, and now that I'm I'm I'm teaching full-time, I my students have uh I had had to set boundaries with my students and give them instructions that were clear, concise, and to the point. I I replied to emails promptly, except on assignment due date. Do not send me an email between five o'clock and midnight on assignment due date because I'm not responding. I had to set that boundary and then I found the quality of assignments started improving. The early submission of assignments started getting better because I set that boundary. And I'm like, wow, if I can set a boundary for my students, then I need to set other boundaries in responding to other people and other things. So I think disconnecting and not responding or feeling the need to respond is so important because everything uh in this world needs to unplug at some point. It may be for uh 30 minutes, it may be for several hours, but we have to pick and choose when to disconnect, and knowing that disconnecting is so important to our our mental health.

SPEAKER_04: 47:24

I love it, I love it. We got a comment coming in from our brother TO. He's the uh founder and host of the Light Blood Light Bulb Lessons podcast, and he says, Great conversation, the machine will keep on machining. That's true right there, brother. Discipline, instant, willing, obedience to put the device down. Yes, sir. That's that's shout out to yo, man. Miss you, brother. Uh oh. Okay, I'm gonna let y'all work that I'm gonna let y'all work that one.

SPEAKER_03: 47:58

He he he know the deadline. I'll take later Sunday. No, sir, no, sir.

SPEAKER_04: 48:04

What's up, man? As you said, man, I I love that, and I don't I don't think that this feels heavy to me because I feel like men need to hear this, so I want to just put this out here real brief and real simple. I at least I think it's simple, and I love what you said about the power of the choice. A lot of times, as men, we don't feel like I'm speaking for all men. Maybe I shouldn't do that, but generally speaking, I don't think we feel like we have that. We feel like things are being dictated for us, decisions are being made for us, and we gotta just kind of just line up with it because if we don't, somebody might think we're not a man, or we're not the the man that we're supposed to be, or the or the right kind of man, or what have you. I love the idea you shared about the power of choice to say yes or say no or say later. So I love that. When I text folks, I'll be honest about it because I got so many things going on and I'm moving. It's the a-type personality thing. I can't do nothing, nothing about that. It is what it is. When I text, a lot of times, to be honest, I feel like I need a response back man. I can't I can't wait, I can't wait 72 hours for what I text you about if it's uh something that requires your response. But I get what you're saying, everybody's situation is not my situation, everybody's emergency is not mine, so I get that. But full disclosure is not about you about you guys, Tracy is rough. If I text you about, okay, you know, do you want to be on the podcast this week? Do you want the interview to be on this date? Do you want to go out for coffee? Or that's time sensitive. I need to hear something about within the day at least. For me, within six hours is fantastic. I love it. But anyway, that's just me. But on every show, I always think I always ask at least one tough question. I think this might be the one for this show, perhaps. I think everything was challenging, but this is a tough one. Now, as a man dealing with the digital world and digital age that we're in, talking about disciplines and that kind of stuff. Where do your eyes go to when you log into the the app? What's the online indulgence that you gotta fight against the most? So there's kind of two questions, but the answer is probably gonna just give you one answer, though. That's easy. I'll jump a distraction for you.

SPEAKER_01: 50:19

Yeah, yeah, I'll jump on that one. Uh the DMs, man. Um DMs immediately. Immediately, yeah. Um, you know, I'll be uh putting together show notes for a podcast, and I'll pop into PodMatch or something to like get a website, you know, off someone's account, and I'll see that little indicator that says, you know, four four messages waiting for me. And it's like it's like you know, an alcoholic trying to not have a drink. I'm like, I gotta check the message, someone's trying to reach me, you know, and especially on a DM, because it's like, okay, someone sent me a DM, it might be Mr. U. He needs me to like you know respond right now. So I I need to get on that message, man. Because the expectation is that we all see it immediately and we all can respond immediately, and no one's too busy. And and and that is the expectation, it's fair, you know. So when you know that that's what everybody expects of you, it's like, oh, well, if that's one of my coaching clients and I don't respond to them, then maybe they're gonna get mad and then they won't want to work with me anymore because I took too long and I'm not getting them attention. That inner battle, oh my god, that inner battle is all day, every day. Every time I open another app, that that dm, that message, that blink, it's like I've got to know now. That's the hardest part. Easy, hands.

SPEAKER_04: 51:29

That is tough. That's that's a tough one, man. Wow, I'm feeling there's the weight of that over here. I think I I'm guilty of it. That's why I probably me too. Who else? Who else? Anybody else?

SPEAKER_02: 51:42

Mine's the Doom Scroll. The Doom Scroll. I'm generally so disciplined about staying focused on what I'm trying to do. And my time is tight, just like all you guys, right? I've got four shows, I uh produce other people's shows, I've got digital marketing work I freelance for people. So I've got those clients I'm dealing with, and then I've got my family, right? And whatever my family's involved with, whether my kids are involved with a play right now or whether it's basketball season or whatever, right? I've got that stuff going on. And so I'm usually so disciplined about just moving from one thing to the next. The only time I slow down is when I sit down with my family to watch a show or two before they go to bed or something. And so because I normally run 14 to 17 hour days at least, it's so easy for me when I jump on Facebook or Instagram, particularly. Because, you know, if you're a content creator, you know you actually have to get on those platforms a little bit and at least respond to some other people and and like comment on some other people, or you get no traction anywhere. It's why I have smaller followings on social media because I don't do what you're supposed to do and jump on LinkedIn and spend 15 minutes commenting on other people's posts. I don't do that, otherwise, I would have much followings. Um, because I hate those apps, I don't actually like to spend time on them. I jump on, I post, I jump off. But then I'll see something from one of the people I actually care about following on Facebook or something. And all of a sudden, when I jumped on to post, I catch myself scrolling for like five or ten minutes, and then that five or ten minutes goes to an hour, is gone, right? Or I'll do the same thing when I'll jump on Instagram to post something and I'll start scrolling. And then it's like my brain goes, I can breathe, I can check out, I can I can just be numb for a few minutes instead of being focused. And that that relief of not being focused because it's it's you you know it's hard to be focused all the time, you know it's hard to stay on task all the time, right? You you have to discipline your brain to do that, and so your brain's like, woo, right? This doesn't actually matter, no one gives a crap. This isn't gonna burn the world down. Uh, and so I'll start doom scrolling, especially my my particular weakness is like politics. I I follow way too many politics stuff, and so I'll start scrolling on that, reading about politics, reading news stories, and and then it's like, oh crap, I lost 30 minutes or 40 minutes, and I really have that 30 or 40 minutes to lose.

SPEAKER_03: 54:28

Yeah, I I can agree with you more, Brent. Um, mine is is reading too much, and that may sound like counterproductive, but I read 50 to 75 articles every day. I'm constantly reading because I'm constantly trying to stay up on current events and talk about those current events at it as it relates to communication and public speaking. So I'm always bringing new content to the to the classroom with my students. But man, I spend so much time reading and taking notes, and I could have a conversation with a student and read an article, and now I'm emailing the student this article. Hey, you know, look at this. And I'm like, what am I doing? It does fulfill me though, but man, it can be time consuming. Uh just reading and reading and reading and reading. I'm not always posting or commenting, but I am reading the the article, and then sometimes I'm reading the comments at the bottom of the article to kind of get a vibe for how people are responding to what's being written. So that that would be my advice is is reading too much. And I never thought I would say reading too much is it could be a bad thing, but for me sometimes it's not moms and dads around the world are are happy that's happening.

SPEAKER_04: 55:50

They celebrate this for me. All right, Aaron, how about you, brother?

SPEAKER_00: 55:55

Man, rounding this out, like I'm I'm probably an equal mix between what Rory said about you know, reading the D the messages and and the you know, getting back to people as someone who's building a business and a coaching business, and you know, I I feel like I have to, you know, I have to get back to people. I have to to to to connect and I'm not being fast enough. And uh but then also Brent, man, like I I'm doing exactly what what you're not trying to do, you know, is is like I I'm posting content on social media, and then that leads to having to send messages and having to, you know, like scroll on certain things and and be active, an active member on social media, and it's time consuming as hell. The last one though that really gets me, and I I think you guys are gonna laugh about this because some of you have been in podcasts with me, is having conversations with people, talking. I will end up in a conversation with somebody, and 45 minutes will go by. And all of a sudden I'm like, man, I went to the coffee shop to work and I got an hour's worth of work done. And I sat for an hour and a half in a conversation with somebody that was fulfilling and felt great, but wasted a lot of my time and and you know, pushed back my list of tasks that I needed to get done that day, way back to where now I'm now I ran out of time. Now I gotta go pick up my kids from school and and you know, work is is secondary because parenting is number one at that point, you know. So for me, it's it's a lot, it's a lot of being on social media and trying to build that business, but it's also getting caught in conversation. And you know, that's just a part of who I am, and and probably why I'm doing this as a job, because it's pretty easy for me to talk.

SPEAKER_02: 57:54

I don't know how you guys not do that. Aaron, the the valid part of that statement that you made on that, the conversation isn't what you're regretting. It's this push back the to-do list, right? I've I've never had a conversation, a real conversation that I regretted spending time on. I understand pushing back on the to-do list, though, right?

SPEAKER_00: 58:19

Yes, I agree with you. You know, I guess for me, I I have like a little guilt because it'll be a conversation about someone's dog or something that's not, you know, yeah, and there's fulfillment in that because you have a you have an emotional connection and you're you're connecting with people and that has value to it. It's it's just one of those things where I was like, man, I really had an agenda trying to be disciplined about getting my agenda done, and you know, and then it just got thrown out the window.

SPEAKER_04: 58:49

You try, Eric. I only have one more question left, but uh one of our uh comments has dropped a question that I want us to touch. Uh first off, Angel, thanks for jumping into the comment section and dropping this question for us. Keeps us working, so we appreciate it. It says as AI becomes more integrated into daily life and people grow increasingly relying on it. How does digital discipline determine the kind of legacy we leave for future generations? I had a question along that line with a sort of cutting room floor now, but you brought it back out. So thank you. I love it, I love it. All right, so great question. How does digital discipline determine the kind of legacy we leave for future generations? Anybody want to jump right after it?

SPEAKER_03: 59:37

Yeah, I'll jump in. Uh I'll I'll say uh I heard an analysis about the dangers of using generative AI and how it's gonna affect this generation and future generations, and the argument could be framed like this we are giving people a tool to use and not showing them how to use the tool. Okay, and if I give all of you a hammer, it doesn't make you a uh carpenter, it just makes you a dude with a hammer. And if you find uh uh a use for that hammer, you'll now you'll hammer screws, you'll hammer everything because that's the tool you have. So the tool of generative AI is not gonna destroy the world if we teach young people how to use it, which means we have to jump in and learn how to use it and use it for the right and productive uh reasons. So I I'm I'm not afraid of AI. I embrace it, I'm not going to reject it because people are using it. But if they are using it, uh I encourage all of us to be inquisitive about how are you doing what you're doing in the AI and is it giving you what you need it to give you, which is one thing, again, I I challenge my students with. If they want to use AI to help them with an assignment, I encourage them to use it and cite it, but not create. And then I have them physically show me in in class on the board what they did with the prompt, and then I can show them different ways of prompting to get various answers and then comparing the results and not just going with the first result that the machine spits out. So that would be uh my answer to the question.

SPEAKER_04: 1:01:39

Yeah. I don't know what the technical name of it is, but I guess it's some kind of AI psychosis type deal where users kind of rely on AI too much, and it goes beyond the technical and just you know, like trying to form or draft a letter or a resume, and it turns into getting dating advice from AI or trying to try to understand how to deal with uh our personal situations. Like one thing about AI QIT, you don't understand is that it means artificial intelligence, and what we put into it, it basically gives us what we think we want. It's like if you go if you go into chat GPT, you're never gonna hear anything negative about you. It's always gonna be spot on. You're the best. The whole world loves your show. The data doesn't say that, but it's the AI's gonna say the whole world love you. You podcasts are the best in the world. Do this, do that, because you're the greatest. If you rely on that to kind of give you a ego boost and encourage you through life, you got bigger problems than just AI. But as far as the uh the kind of legacy, uh I want to hear from you guys, the rest of you guys, you know, what kind of legacy can I think you guys answer that to a degree, but what do you think is a uh how is discipline gonna help create the kind of legacy that you think is needed for future generations? What are you guys thinking about that?

SPEAKER_02: 1:03:10

Without digital discipline, you will not leave a legacy, period. There is a difference between legacy and memory. Right? You can leave, you can die. And leave no legacy because you were so self-involved, so self-focused, so just not a person who actually interacts with other people or does something to try and make the world better. You can leave no legacy. If you don't have digital discipline, that's exactly what you're gonna be. You're gonna have no legacy because it will distract you. This is a multi-trillion dollar industry to steal your attention 24 hours a day. Companies are spending billions of dollars a year learning how to keep you attached to your phone and to your screen. Every social media app, the media companies, the movie industry, period. They're all spending billions of dollars a year mastering keeping your attention. Without digital discipline, you will not leave a legacy because you will not impact the world around you.

SPEAKER_00: 1:04:34

I think that there's actually a way to kind of intermix both what Steve and Brent said. Uh you know, again, like you said, Brent, this is something, and Youssef, you said this as well, is like this is an industry that's not going anywhere. They're spending billions of dollars in in AI to maximize that, right? And I think we have a responsibility to try to try to use that to our advantage. And I say that very intricately because we could easily use it to do all the things and not actually use our brains. Like like Steve said, that first initial prompt that you put into Chat GPT does the work for you. Now your brain immediately goes, Oh, I don't have to do that work. I have this machine that can do it for me. And it almost turns us into the movie Idiocracy, right? Like there's potential for that. But there's also potential to maximize that and learn how to in like how to create prompts that will do the things that will elevate your legacy and elevate, like like I'll give you an example. As a writer, I I use ChatGPT, but I don't use Chat GPT to or or whatever AI app to write for me. I use it to be a non-objective magazine editor to really push me to be a better writer, to really get in. And I use examples of famous editors and using all of their style to then critique what my work is and to push me to actually be better at what it is. I I spend hours and hours actually working with that as a way to elevate what my writing does. And sometimes it doesn't work at all. And I have to understand, like, okay, this is not working, like let's let's go in a different direction. But I think the key thing is that, you know, what brent what what what kind of what Brent was saying is like this is this isn't isn't going anywhere. And if we if we don't if we don't have digital discipline, and we don't have discipline in in using the tools, we're it's going to it's going to to use the use us instead. You know, there there was a really funny uh video that went around. I'm I'm sure you guys might have watched it, but uh there was a uh it was a video making fun of AI. And what happened was is a guy walks into a bodega or like a little market, and the the attendant says, you know, hey, how can I help you? And the guy freaks out and he goes, uh I don't know how to answer this question, goes into chat GPT and says, the guy just asked me how can he help me? What do I do? And then it gives you and you know, gives a response, and then he reads the response to the person. And then that person goes, oh, he wants, you know, a hammer. And he goes, Where are hammers? And then goes into chat, you know, and it's like this whole back and forth that is used, you know. I mean, it's it's using the chat GPT or or whatever AI to answer for us. And I think what what makes that video so great is that that's the potential of where we can go, where we don't actually have our own thoughts and our own opinions if we allow that machine to do the work for us. Copy that.

SPEAKER_04: 1:07:58

All right, we got one time for one more question. Hopefully, we can move through pretty quickly. Then, of course, if we have any uh desire to share info with our people so they can follow you, keep up with you, and put that in the main chat. But here's where I want to end the show. We talk a lot about men supporting other men, collaborating, extending ourselves to other men, and being uh examples and support to them because you understand what they're going through. We're talking about being in an over-connected world, like what we're talking about right now, with all the things that challenge us and entertain us. Where's the accountability for you personally in this? I know that's so you mentioned your children and you know them kind of slapping you in the hand and saying put your phone down, but beyond beyond that place, are there other men that you have that are part of uh or symbols of accountability for you, like an accountability partnership to deal with issues like this? Do you guys have that? Do you find value in it? Would you like to do that? Do you hate the idea? Kind of share that real quick and we got a limited amount of time, so be brief as you can, please. Go ahead. Thank you, Tio.

SPEAKER_02: 1:09:15

I think there can be a lot of value to it, but it also depends on the personality of the person, right? I don't use regular accountability partners. There is a lot of value for it. I'm a coach as well, right? So I understand some people need help holding accountability. Some people have things in their life that hold them accountable without having another person involved. So it really is gonna boil down to your personality type. Some people need that extra person who is gonna call them on it. Some people just have people in their lives who are gonna call them out on stuff like this anyway. And so it is really gonna boil down to who you are. It's not a bad thing, but it's really gonna boil down to a very personal issue of do you need somebody or do you actually have people who are gonna call you out on things? Got it. Thank you, sir. Who next? Real quick, please.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:12

All right, I'll go. Um, and and you, that was a very smart decision of you not to give me the mic talking about AI, because you know how I feel about that stuff, brother. Um, but anyway, as far as this goes, um uh I have an accountability partner and uh I have a group where we have accountability partners. And um, you know, I understand where Brent's coming from because I have for for a long time, I felt like, hey, I'm I'm leading the group, so my accountability partner is the group. But I also believe that every coach needs a coach, and that coach needs a coach, and then that coach has a coach. And at some point, you know, everybody needs a mentor or a coach that they can lean on. And when you become the last guy in the chain where everybody else is leaning all the way up, and then you don't have anybody to lean on, you're the one who breaks, inevitably. Um, I had to kind of put my ego away on that one a while ago and say, all right, I I need an accountability partner for myself. And so um, you know, it is valuable, it does help, but it also helps on the way back down then, because you know, you can kind of check your own nonsense, um, make sure that you're staying on task, especially when you're leading other groups and when you have other people looking at you. So it's it's essential in my world, it's essential.

SPEAKER_04: 1:11:19

Absolutely. All right, we got like two minutes.

SPEAKER_03: 1:11:22

Well, my accountability partner primarily is my wife. I run every uh I learned over the course of 26 years all the times that I didn't run things by her, it was not right. So ultimately I go to her, she holds me accountable. Then I have other other mentors, peers, uh coach to is a prime example. Our 20 plus year relationship, we use each other as sounding boards, uh as sanity checks. So, well said, every coach needs a coach, every mentor needs a mentor. Uh we're never too old or wise to stop learning. I love it, I love it.

SPEAKER_04: 1:12:06

Thank you guys for jumping in here this morning and and doing this. This has been uh a very interesting conversation. Not quite sure we covered everything, but it was a lot of meat on the bone, and you guys did a great job taking care of this. If you, if anybody that's watching and listening, is interested in potentially being a panelist on a future broadcast, or you want to just catch up on all of the shows that we've done so far since June. Upper right hand corner of your screens, a QR code. You got about 30 seconds to grab it. If you're listening and you're not watching, you get us on all listening platforms, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRabio, Pandora, etc. We're on all those places, and of course, on YouTube, Facebook, and LinkedIn as well. So uh thank you guys for joining the uh men's roundtable series podcast. We talked about discipline in the digital world, and it was exciting to say the least. Can't wait to see you guys in 2026. Have a Merry Christmas and a happy new year. Hope everything's good for you. Thank you guys so much for being here today.